fabrication advice needed

Always good to have some helpful tips when making stove.
Where to get materials cheap, what tool is best.
How to do a specific task. Anything that will help.
BrokenAeroVT
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by BrokenAeroVT » Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:00 pm

Vibe wrote:An electrical connection "Knock out" set would probably work better. Harbor Freight has a set that would handle AL pretty well - there may well be a punch/die set in there that will do what you want. It's wrench/screw driven or there are hydraulic power units that will operate it. Manual is of course the less expensive route.

http://www.harborfreightusa.com/usa/ite ... emid=91201
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That looks promising. How much (ball park) would a kit like that run me? It looks like you drill a small hole then attach a bolt through two pieces that are on opposite sides of the metal then rotate with a wrench, scoring the metal until it drops a disc?

I really appreciate everyone's help here, by the way. I understand science and mathematics very well, but fabrication is more of a handicap. I'm working with limited fabrication knowledge, few tools and perhaps insufficient patience needed to handle such a task.

BrokenAeroVT
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by BrokenAeroVT » Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:06 pm

hoz wrote:A Forstner bit might work, for a few holes...
I don't know what that is, but I'll google it and find out. Sounds promisingly cheap at least! :DB:

BrokenAeroVT
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by BrokenAeroVT » Mon Sep 21, 2009 6:19 pm

Given that I'm working on a thick bottomed cottle, and I've removed a short cup from the bottom of the cottle, if I drilled a small hole then used a 1-1/4 spade bit, if I was careful, do you think this would work? Otherwise I might use a Forstner bit since it is closer to a hole saw.

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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by Ridgerunner » Mon Sep 21, 2009 8:11 pm

There are alot of listings on ebay for step drill bits that go up to 1 3/8 inches.
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realityguy
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by realityguy » Mon Sep 21, 2009 8:54 pm

Personally I'd use a hole saw(standard fine saw teeth) with a battery powered drill and slow speed for accuracy(CHEAP!).Drill most of the way through(straight down with pressure),then back through the bottom the other way if possible to do the least damage to the edges...You are talking about an aluminum pop/beer bottle right(cottle?)?A forstener bit of that size will be pretty pricey and they don't usually have a good feed screw center unless you get special ones specifically for aluminum that use a 1/4" center bit;even more expensive...
As long as you need a specific size by 1/16s' or 1/8s' a holesaw can be pretty cheap.
The hole punch sets can be pricey..or crap(if they are from harbor freight...)Sorry..my opinion of harbor freight is equal to their quality.. :lol: Hole punch sets are generally for thin steel but would work for aluminum also.
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by Vibe » Mon Sep 21, 2009 11:23 pm

realityguy wrote: The hole punch sets can be pricey..or crap(if they are from harbor freight...)Sorry..my opinion of harbor freight is equal to their quality.. :lol: Hole punch sets are generally for thin steel but would work for aluminum also.
Granted the HF KO punch kit is no Greenlee bu it should work for this purpose. I have bo idea of the price though - From HF it's not going to be a lot.
A spade bit, with the edge dutting spur, turned by hand cpould very well work. It'd take time, but the cit would be fairly clean - if you can keep from wallowing out the pilot hole.
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by realityguy » Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:08 am

Harbor Freight hole punch set is $15.99,should work fine for 1/16" aluminum...Spade bits have flat spur bits..if the spur hole does get a little out of whack,everything will be.A hole saw uses a 1/4"(cheaper ones use 1/8" or 3/16")round metal/wood drilling bit that stays more true and smaller saw teeth.
I have seen reworked spade bits where people have used a round and flat file to make the outside point the only cutting surface so the bit doesn't drag in the inside area,only cutting at the outside point making a better quality hole overall.
Forstner bits have a flat "chisel" cutting blade which wouldn't cut the aluminum for the inner circle,a sharp blade on the outer edge and usually a 3-4 sided spur bit.Metal cutting type hole saw bits use several carbide surfaces on only the outer edge,usually about 1/8" thick or smaller that drag and cut the surface cleanly with a standard drill bit as a spur.The "adjustable" hole saw usually has a 1/8 or 1/4" standard spur bit with a cross bar that holds a square carbide bit(45 degree cut corner to corner on the bottom held with a set screw for depth) that drags on the outer point cutting the hole. Because there is only 1 or 2 cutting surfaces,they can cut rough(and scary to cut with).
Myself..I usually use a full size drill press with hole saws for aluminum..held in a cross vice.I use forstners for wood and making finer holes or appropriate sized hole saws.I build large format cameras and make a lot of lensboards from 1/8" aluminum and 1/4" wood with sometimes rabbeted center holes in the wood ones to mount large lenses.The aluminum boards I use only hole saws.If I need an additional 1/16" in the perimeter of the hole saw,I use a sanding spindle to increase the hole until the lenses fit right and to smooth the edges.
The views and opinions expressed by this person are his own and not the general consensus of others on this website.Realityguy

BrokenAeroVT
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by BrokenAeroVT » Tue Sep 22, 2009 3:04 am

realityguy wrote:Harbor Freight hole punch set is $15.99,should work fine for 1/16" aluminum...Spade bits have flat spur bits..if the spur hole does get a little out of whack,everything will be.A hole saw uses a 1/4"(cheaper ones use 1/8" or 3/16")round metal/wood drilling bit that stays more true and smaller saw teeth.
I have seen reworked spade bits where people have used a round and flat file to make the outside point the only cutting surface so the bit doesn't drag in the inside area,only cutting at the outside point making a better quality hole overall.
Forstner bits have a flat "chisel" cutting blade which wouldn't cut the aluminum for the inner circle,a sharp blade on the outer edge and usually a 3-4 sided spur bit.Metal cutting type hole saw bits use several carbide surfaces on only the outer edge,usually about 1/8" thick or smaller that drag and cut the surface cleanly with a standard drill bit as a spur.The "adjustable" hole saw usually has a 1/8 or 1/4" standard spur bit with a cross bar that holds a square carbide bit(45 degree cut corner to corner on the bottom held with a set screw for depth) that drags on the outer point cutting the hole. Because there is only 1 or 2 cutting surfaces,they can cut rough(and scary to cut with).
Myself..I usually use a full size drill press with hole saws for aluminum..held in a cross vice.I use forstners for wood and making finer holes or appropriate sized hole saws.I build large format cameras and make a lot of lensboards from 1/8" aluminum and 1/4" wood with sometimes rabbeted center holes in the wood ones to mount large lenses.The aluminum boards I use only hole saws.If I need an additional 1/16" in the perimeter of the hole saw,I use a sanding spindle to increase the hole until the lenses fit right and to smooth the edges.
These are all great ideas everyone.

RG, so that I can understand exactly what you are talking about, can you go to the Lowes or Home Depot website and link me to a 1 inch hole saw that you think will do the job in a bud lite cottle bottom?

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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by realityguy » Tue Sep 22, 2009 11:23 am

http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=p ... lpage=none

Unfortunately Lowe's only lists the expensive ones at the website..You can get cheap Black & Decker sets that stack and have several(4?) sizes for $5-7 or so.You get one universal three part arbor(spur bit,base,and lockdown nut)and 4 different size hole saws(1" to 2-1/8"(?)2-1/8" is standard size for doorknobs,1-1/2" for deadbolt holes so both are probably included).You can probably spin them backwards in a drill for a smoother hole.Take it slow and try not to overheat the metal for a better cut.
The Bimetal ones are better for cutting aluminum but more expensive also.If you only need one size,you may need to buy a seperate arbor(center mount portion)..then add more sizes as you need/want them.I'm in construction so have them up to about 4-1/2" that fit a standard Milwaukee arbor for things like vent pipes and dryer vents.I've used them in sizes to about 8" for installing can lights in acoustical ceiling panels.
I do have the cheap sets also for the smaller sizes for use in the drill press.I filled in the voids they usually sell by 1/8" sizes with some certain ones that I seem to drill a lot for lenses.You can get them by 1/16" variables so picked up some like 1-3/16" and 1-5/16,which I seem to use a lot for lens mount rings.
Forstner bits I have in 1/8s from about 3/8 to 2"(Most are used in fine woodworking)..2-1/8(doorknob hole jig),larger ABS plumbing Selfeed bits(2-1/4" and 3-5/8").

If anybody is interested..I do have a nice set of those two last bits for sale..Milwaukee Selfeed 3-5/8"(for 3" abs pipe..in the box with an extra spur bit,used for one house..reg about $100),a 2-1/4" M. SF.(for 2" abs..more use than the other but okay),and an extension that fits both...for $60..I don't need two sets anymore!I'll see if I have an extra
bit for the 1-1/2" abs and throw that in the deal.Google Milwaukee Selfeed bits for retail prices..if you need them,that's a bargain! ;)

BA..planning on building any BIG stoves? :lol: Gotta go to work! :evil:
The views and opinions expressed by this person are his own and not the general consensus of others on this website.Realityguy

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Ridgerunner
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Re: fabrication advice needed

Post by Ridgerunner » Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:23 pm

"Many of lifes failures are people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up".....Thomas Edison

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