What do you guys think about this????????

Always good to have some helpful tips when making stove.
Where to get materials cheap, what tool is best.
How to do a specific task. Anything that will help.
stevebo
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What do you guys think about this????????

Post by stevebo » Sat Dec 18, 2010 8:40 pm

I was on the internet the other day and found this website http://www.northwestjournal.ca/XVI1645.htm As a stovie, i immediatly saw lots of potential, stoves, kelly kettles etc. What I thought was interesting was, at the end of the article, the author mentions that for a cooking pot use tin as solder, and be sure to coat the surface of your pot with tin-------I ("Tining — The kettle must be tinned with 100% pure tin. Bare copper is not food safe for cooking pots, nor is lead-free plumber's solder containing antimony.")

I would think copper would be a safe material to make a kettle (storm kettle etc) out of, but this article/website kind of makes it sound like it could be toxic? (its got to be better for you than JB weld!) Just wanted your input on using sheet copper to make a kettle---storm kettle etc. What do you guys think? :?

realityguy
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by realityguy » Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:57 pm

I found that website when I was doing some research on my copper kettle I had for "carcamping" a few weeks ago.. :roll:

Image

Heck..you could a whole 'possum stew in that one.. :o

Actually..it's a candy cauldron(dovetailed joints also) for making candy,weighed 12lbs..never could find a lid to fit it so I sold it.. :lol: .I think the copper poison thing is more based towards acidic type foods interacting with the metal or solder..otherwise why would they use them for candy?..supposedly the round bottom prevents the candy from sticking as much to the pot.. :roll:
????...
I would think the weight and work in making that camp-pot,tinning,etc..would be more hassle than I would want to do..unless I had nothing else to do with my time.
The views and opinions expressed by this person are his own and not the general consensus of others on this website.Realityguy

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ridebks
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by ridebks » Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:56 pm

Wasn't there a Zelph vs Tinny thing, a while ago, about copper?

stevebo
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by stevebo » Sat Dec 18, 2010 11:41 pm

So, if you were just boiling water, copper wouldnt be a problem, ????????

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zelph
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by zelph » Sun Dec 19, 2010 12:28 am

Bare copper is good for sugar and water. No cooking of other foods.

Tinny stopped making his copper death pots. I scared him off. He listens when I speak :o :mrgreen: He's here every day watching what I do with wick material. He likes wicks. ;)

Making your own kettle is a good project. The site gives good detail on the how to. Thanks for the link, useful info there. :D
http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/

JollyRogers
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by JollyRogers » Sun Dec 19, 2010 5:49 am

Copper in and of it self is ok to burn but not necessarily to cook with. So for stove parts or for kettle parts that will not come in contact with food it is fine. I see from other threads Zelph linked to that there has been some nasty debate over this topic. I'm not willing to go into debate over any of it. I'll just generalize and say that as a rule I don't cook food in contact with copper. Although I have used coper/silver ionizers to sterilize water on a commercial level. So yes, just boiling water in a copper kettle would generally be fine. But then again, I don't do it so take that as you will.

Copper is used to carry water lines all over the planet. One of the reasons no one ever thinks of is that it doesn't give off toxic fumes when it burns. Building materials have to meet certain toxicity requirements including the toxicity of those building materials when they are on fire. Water lines especially since heated water can vaporize and carry those toxins in the form of a water vapor and steam.

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zelph
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by zelph » Sun Dec 19, 2010 12:27 pm

Yes, it's all personal preference. They still use asbestos in automobile brake pads. As the brakes are applied asbestos is given off into the air. Lots of things going on out there that harm our health, too numerous to mention. Copper is fda approved for certain foods.
http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/

stevebo
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by stevebo » Mon Dec 20, 2010 9:52 am

Thanks for the great info! (Zelph, i got a big kick out of the "copper death pot " reference!----I guess Tinney at MBD is the stove equivalant to Mr Hennesy in the hammock forums---very controverisial due to their business ethics concerning other peoples ideas!) What I had in mind, was something in line with the Kelly Kettle--in concept, a stove that just boils water. (my application is a little different, but the theory is the same--its just a water boiler) I thought of copper because has great heat transfer abilities. I love working with aluminum, but I was concerned about health issues. Im not sure about stainless steel. So, if I wanted to make a water boiling apparatus (that sounds so official and technical LOL!) what would be the ideal material to use, thats doesnst pose a health hazard, but is also not too heavy? (I havnt built anything yet, this is just an idea Im kicking around) ( Water would be boiled inside the stove, like a KK)

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zelph
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by zelph » Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:43 am

So, if I wanted to make a water boiling apparatus (that sounds so official and technical LOL!) what would be the ideal material to use, thats doesnst pose a health hazard, but is also not too heavy? (I havnt built anything yet, this is just an idea Im kicking around) ( Water would be boiled inside the stove, like a KK)
I would use copper. Seal the seams with pure tin. You might be able to form the seams so they are very tight and not have to use tin. Once formed you could boil some mineral laden spring water in it a few times so the lime deposits would seal the seam. :mrgreen: Read up on copper forming a little more than what you have and try doing some mini size pots straight wall design and test the seams. When your ready to do the big one make your paper templates and when all seems well, go back and measure 2 times more and then you only have to cut once. ;)

Ilike love my base camp stainless KK. I'm watching for the stainless backpack size to be available.
Apply safety (lead-free) flux to the inside edge of the lid and the seam. Solder from the inside using only 100% pure tin.

You must not use plumber’s solder for this work ; it contains antimony as a lead substitute, to allow the solder to melt at a lower temperature than pure tin. Antimony is less toxic than lead, and is safe in small amounts for water systems, but it is not recommended for cooking pots!
We only want to boil water in a copper pot or when we want to melt sugar for us sugar junkies :mrgreen:
http://www.woodgaz-stove.com/

JollyRogers
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Re: What do you guys think about this????????

Post by JollyRogers » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:06 am

Aluminum, stainless or titanium would be the metals of choice. Cast iron is just too heavy and takes too much fuel/energy to heat up. Just for boiling water copper is fine but the pot will not be as light or as versatile for cooking as ones made out of other materials. Your body can process copper and needs it as part of your daily diet, but too much of it can have harmful effects. Although copper poisoning has always been rare, I would pass on it for no other reason that other materials are more versatile for cooking, more durable and weigh less.

The aluminum "contamination/leeching" from aluminum cook pots thing has never been proven to leech more than the aluminum contained in our normal multi-vitamins, medications, food, or antiperspirants we use every day. The alleged Alzheimer’s link has since been debunked as no studies have shown any recognizable link to the disease from cooking with aluminum.
The idea that aluminum cook pots was linked comes from the fact that Alzheimer’s patients have higher concentrations of aluminum in their brain tissue. It has since been discovered one of the effects of Alzheimer’s is that your body deposits more aluminum in your brain tissue. Not the other way around.
Salty or acidic foods can break down aluminum and because of this it is not good for food storage. This includes aluminum foil. While not dangerous it will taint the flavor of the food over time as more aluminum breaks down and is absorbed by the food.

Probably the worst stuff you could use is anything with Teflon, Silverstone or a no-stick finish. That stuff scratches off and gives off toxic chemicals, including 2 types of carcinogens if it gets too hot. DuPont studies show that Teflon off-gases toxic particulates at 446°F. At 680°F Teflon pans release at least six toxic gases, including two carcinogens. DuPont acknowledges that the fumes can sicken people, a condition called “polymer fume fever.”
Alcohol stoves and campfires burn at well over 500°F. For this reason alone non-stick coated cookware should be avoided for camp cooking.

This bit of information has been brought to you by a random internet "know-it-all". :mrgreen:

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